what exactly is a JCW Pkg?

[Agnt006]

So I know this is a dumb question, but Im trying to become more edjumacated in all things Mini, so I'm asking. :ms_bye:
Is this kind of like in Jeeps where you can add all the various upgrades after market and have it effectively become a rubicon, or is it one of those things where its so inherently different that no matter how many after market parts you add, you'll never truly have a JCW?
Im sure one of you guys can answer this for me, I just wanted to understand better. I dont like being a "clueless girl" if I can avoid it. :jester:
Melissa

[Bacman33]

I hope I'm not stealing any JCW owners thunder here, and correct me if I am wrong, but in 2008 and 2009, there is actually a official JCW vehicle with it's own pricing. It is advertised as a 208 HP performance tuned vehicle. From what I can see, which is over and above what is offered in the S version, is a cold air induction, exhaust with enlarged chrome tips, larger brake calipers (Brembo), Challenge 17" wheels, some badging, DTC (Dynamic Traction Control) and EDLC (Electronic Differential Lock Control). I also believe that the computers management has been flashed to take advantage of the modifications. I believe the base price is somewhere in the vacinity of 29K. I also believe that most of the mods available on the JCW can be purchased seperately, and there are also upgrades such as body kits, dash inserts and such that can be added on based upon owner preference.

[BThayer23]

Bacman33, the JCW you're referring to is the 2009 factory JCW package. It has to be ordered from the factory, and it's only available (so far) for the 2009 model year, which is the second case that MacLeod mentioned.

There's also a dealer-installed JCW engine kit for the 2007-2009 models, which includes an intake, ECU reprogramming, and exhaust. This kit can be ordered and installed before the owner takes delivery or retrofitted. 201 hp, I believe.

For more on the factory cars vs dealer-installed kits, read this: http://www.motoringfile.com/2008/11/17/mf-review-jcw-stage-i-vs-stage-ii/

And then there's the JCW engine kit for the R53, which is 2002-2006 model years for the hardtop and 2004-2008 for the convertible. The same kit can be installed at the factory or by the dealer, for 210 hp.

Both the R56 (2007-2009) and R53 engine kits add a JCW badge to the car, but only the engine is upgraded. There are also JCW suspension kits, which add a thicker swaybar, stiffer springs, and lower the car by approx. 0.75", and JCW brake kits for the R53 and the R56. The JCW brakes are generally bigger calipers and drilled rotors.

The 2009 JCW factory car comes with the JCW brakes, but not the JCW suspension, which is optional.

It's all very confusing to try to summarize, but it's easy to narrow down once you answer a few questions about your car - what year is it and is it new or used. Factory 2009 JCW is only on new cars, the other engine/brake/suspension kits are retrofittable to used cars or optional on new cars.

Let me know if I messed any of this up.

[BThayer23]

Oh yeah, and there's also JCW aero kits for the R53 and R56 (the R56 actually has a few different aero kits with different names).

The 2009 factory JCW car has elements that cannot be retrofitted to earlier cars. The brake, suspension, and engine kits can be retrofitted, but you can't get the upgraded clutch, ECU remap, and e-diff aftermarket. Think of the factory JCW as a JCW built from the ground up.

The e-diff uses the antilock brake system to slow the inside wheel when turning, which mimics the operation of a mechanical limited slip differential. The BMW 135i has the same thing.

Incidentally, JCW is not analogous to BMW's M Division. M cars are the complete package, wheels, brakes, engine, suspension, badging, etc. You can't retrofit a 330i up to an M3. You can retrofit a Cooper S up to a Cooper S JCW, and while there are a few elements of the 2009 factory JCW that can't be retrofitted, the factory car doesn't come with the JCW suspension or aero kit standard, or even stripes for that matter. Who orders a JCW without stripes? =)

[BThayer23]

Also, I can't afford a new car right now, but I would give the ring toe on my left foot for a 2009 JCW.... droooool....

[Agnt006]

wow that is A LOT of information. lol.. only half of which I understood. lol... Thanks guys!

[BlimeyCabrio]

Ben also failed Mime School.

[BThayer23]

Ben also failed Mime School.

Hahahaha. This is what happens when you stick an engineer behind a desk for too long - verbal diarrhea. And way to call the kettle black - guess whose name is in the top 5 posters? Hint: rhymes with "climey babrio." =)

I also managed to configure a new JCW car while typing that up. So nice... Hope there's one at the track next time I go.

[wildcrazy442000]

There is also the JCW sound kit, suspension and brakes for the R50. The sound kit cost around 1100 or so installed and adds a whopping three hp. JCW wheels are available as well as a carbon fiber dash.

[Agnt006]

ok so that brings up another question then. i know that carbon fiber is like ridiculously light, but is it really doing that much good in using it in things like dashes and spoilers and things, or is it more for aesthetics?

[wildcrazy442000]

Just looks

[Bacman33]

Ok, I'm going to add a little twist to this. Can a JCW flash be accomplished without the JCW mods? The reason I'm asking this, is that a JCW exhaust and intake should not combine to increase the HP from a regular S, which, I think is 172HP, to somewhere near 200. My guess is that the Mini S has an upper range that can be boosted by reprogramming the performance or engine management chip. I spoke with a tech at Morristown Mini about the JCW performance kit, and while somewhat reasonably priced, he stated it involved 4 hours of labor at their shop rate of $125 per hour. I'm thinking that installing the cat-back exhaust and intake could be done a lot less expensive. The flash, I have no idea about.

[wildcrazy442000]

The 2009 Factory JCW has a larger turbo. I think the dealer installed JCW for the 2nd gen cars is around 189 hp. I believe you can get aftermarket flash, but not sure about the dealer software without the whole package.

[WINICooper]

To answer your question easily...

R53- it IS a package that much like a Rubicon where you can take an existing car and upfit it to JCW factory standards

R56- 2007&8- it is a package like a Rubicon where you can take an existing car and upfit it to JCW factory standards

R56- 2009+ it becomes a trim level with items that cannot be duplicated on an existing car.

In the car business, there is "supposed" to be a difference between a package (a bundle of options available on a car) and a trim level (a unique vehicle within a model lineup). Manufacturers very rarely follow that standard these days.

[BThayer23]

I know for the R53 the JCW flash can be added to any car with an intake, pulley, and exhaust, and it will add a moderate performance benefit. Minimark did that for a while, until he had a Jan tune (Jan from RMW), and Mark was much more impressed by the custom tune, if I recall correctly.

My opinion is that you should either go full JCW or full aftermarket. Neither one is designed to the same constraints - the factory is bound to be a bit more conservative, because it's backed by the full warranty. Aftermarket parts aren't so constrained, but there is less support behind them. For example, blowing an engine with a 19% pulley is a very real possibility, which is why the JCW pulley is only an 11.6% reduction, but the 19% pulley will give you a very fast car.

Don't half-a$$ it with a few aftermarket parts and a factory JCW tune, because you're not maximizing the potential of the car and you're not getting any warranty benefit out of the factory tune. Either put on the JCW parts and get the JCW tune installed - just think of the labor as part of the cost of the warranty - or go nuts with the aftermarket parts and invest in an aftermarket tune.

Me? My engine's stock (just an intake for sound), but good luck keeping up. =)

[WINICooper]

Me? My engine's stock (just an intake for sound), but good luck keeping up. =)

I go back and fourth with wanting to do mods... my car is fun enough as it is... but there is always that little bit more. I know I have to do the CAI before I get to BRPT... I may just stop there and invest in things that bring about positive financial returns... but those wheels and exhaust and .... oh boy, that OCMD is kicking in again.

[MINIGURU]

Ok, I'm going to make this clear as I'm getting confused reading this.

For an R53 02-06 MCS the JCW flash doesn't do much, usually just makes it a little smoother, not much gain.

For an R56 07-UP MCS the JCW flash makes ALL the difference. The intake and exhaust they have just makes sound. The power is in the tune.

I do custom tuning and that is definetly the way to go to get bang for your buck and power out of your car. I do sell a flash that I created myself that will give you a few extra HP and improve drivability. Much better than the JCW and safe. For the R56 I will be doing full tunes, and offering the JCW flash if you don't want it dyno tuned.

[Bacman33]

MiniGuru,
Does that mean that the flash is available without the exhaust and intake? If that's so, what benefit does it offer over the stock system?:help:

[MINIGURU]

You can't get the flash from the dealer. I have my own ECU tuning software that we write our own flash or can give the JCW flash.
The flash will give you more HP and Torque, also improve throttle responce. We do it in a variety of ways by changing fuel, timing, and even boost.